This entry was posted by Will21 ( email address confidential ) on Friday, April 13th, 2007 at 10:56 pm and is filed under Supplements. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed.
Splits or whole body
What’s the best way to train with weights - training the whole body each time you’re in the gym, 2-3 times a week or training each body part once a week? Also, how important is a high protein diet? As there is no way I am going to be able to consume 1g per pound of bodyweight a day and I really don’t want to lose muscle mass (I weigh around 200 pounds)
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April 14th, 2007 at 1:53 pm
Don’t ever train your whole body! Do the split method working each body part once a week like you said, you will see the benefits much quicker this way.
A high protein diet is absolutely essential if you want to build muscle, and build it the fastest way possible. those people who don’t exercise need protein for their muscles to function and work properly, so for someone who is weight training, protein should be your best friend!
Loads of people have the same trouble trying to consume so much protein, which is why they turn to supplementing, maybe this is an idea for you to look at?
April 15th, 2007 at 11:07 am
Definitely train the whole body. Splits are useless. The muscles receive little stimulation for growth and it should be a known fact that the more frequently a muscle is trained, the more it is going to grow. Splits only became popular when dianabol was first introduced. Pick one movement for lower body (for example front squats or lunges), and then one for each muscle group in the upper body (Dips, military press, Bent over rows and maybe some isolations). To get bigger - increase the volume, to get stronger increase the intensity. Try not to have both of them too high at the same time, as you’ll burn out and won’t be able to finish.
At 200 pounds, I doubt that is all muscle, therefore you won’t need to consume any protein for the fat mass you have. It has also been shown recently that a high proetein diet isn’t that necessary and also if you come off a high protein diet, you will lose muscle mass as your muscle forms a dependence on the large amount of protein consumed. Quality whey protein supplements can be of help there.
That’s quite a bit to take in there but I hope it helps!
April 15th, 2007 at 10:30 pm
I have to disagree with all that Will said. Training splits have been around long before Dianabol was ever introduced, you can see this by books that have been written at that time. Reg Park was a great old school bodybuilder and he used the training split, and he was around long before Dianabol came into play. And if you want to train the whole body then go for it, you will find it too much and more does not mean it will grow faster, Muscle only grows when it is rested, exercise is the stimulation of muscle, rest is the recovery and growth. And if you train like this you will sure to be overtraining…
Anyone else got opinions on this?
April 16th, 2007 at 8:43 am
I’m afraid you can’t say that Reg Parks was completely off the juice, as I’ve read mixed opinions. However, if he did take any form of steroids, it would have been before they were illegal. Also, here is a training routine used by himself:
A classic Reg Park workout, with one of his training partners, Spencer Churchill, circa 1951, was:
Squats: 5 x 10 x 400 lbs.
Bench Press: 3 x 10 x 320 lbs., 2 x 10 x 350 lbs.
Dumbbell Bench Presses: 5 x 10 x 140 lbs.
Dips Between Chairs: 5 x 12 (with resistance added)
Cheat Barbell Curls: 5 x 10 x 190 lbs.
Swing Bell Curls: 4 x 10 x 170 lbs.
Triceps Extensions on Bench: 5 x 10 x 170 lbs.
French Presses: 5 x 10 x 170 lbs.
Calf Exercises - Donkey Raises: 5 sets
Chins with Extra 60 Lbs. Attached to his Waist
Abdominal Work
This looks like a total body workout to me, and he apparently did this 3 times a week, and gained a fair bit of muscle. I’m not saying that splits can’t be used (or that Park didn’t use them), as they do have their place. But definitely not for beginners, or for someone wanting to gain muscle quick. I myself have used both, and have felt the benefits of total body workouts in half the time. The more frequently the muscle is stimulated, the more it is going to grow. As long as one doesn’t train to failure every time they’re in the gym, the muscle will get used to more frequent stimulation and will increase in size and strength much quicker. Obviously you do need time to rest, but do you really need 7 days to rest each muscle group? I think not. It would take forever to see any results! Overtraining only really occurs if you absolutley drain yourself everytime.
Just keep your workouts less than an hour and make them intense. Have a decent post work out shake, and you won’t have any negative effects. Why don’t you give them a go Ross? You might be surprised.
April 16th, 2007 at 5:05 pm
Both the split and the whole body approach work better for some than others; but personally you will never be able to train each group effectively and to thier potenial if you train your whole body in one go three times a week, you will probably overtrain and you will not target each muscle group very effectively as you will have very limited time. I completely agree with Ross on this one! The only way to work each muscle group in a full body work out would be to use heavy compound lifts- but using heavy compound lifts are the most taxing sort of exercises and you will most likely not be recovered for up to a week. Try and work out your super compensation curve and decide which is best for you!
April 17th, 2007 at 7:10 pm
Wow, you all raised some good points. As I have done a fair few split sessions, I decided to do a whole body workout as it was new and after reading what Will said, I doubt it would kill me. It was by far the best workout I have ever experienced. I did 5 sets of 5 reps for compound movements and 4 sets of 8 for isolations, I didn’t train to failure, but kept it very intense and hit every muscle group. Did some front squats, bench press (with dumbbells), military press (with dumbbells), chin-ups (with a very slow and controlled negative), standing barbell curls, reverse barbell curls and bent-over raises. I’m going to do 3 whole body workouts a week, with different exercises in every session, so as to hit the muscles from every angle. I’ll keep this up for a month or so and see how I feel then. Thanks for all your advice though.
April 17th, 2007 at 7:11 pm
As for the potein, I guess I’m just gonna have to eat more!
April 17th, 2007 at 10:19 pm
Oh I actually just found a very intersesting artical about this very subject! Bit of an eye opener:
http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1335480
April 18th, 2007 at 12:20 am
Yeah some good points from all sides, that’s what this game is all about. So Will, I will try your whole body workout, it’s been a long time since I’ve done one, but it will take me a long time as a few sets for each bodypart will do nothing for me. So give me an example of a hard total body workout and I’ll give it a blast!
April 18th, 2007 at 12:48 am
However, I am very sceptical as I have seen results very quickly from splits when I needed to gain muscle, even when I was a rookie starting out, but like I said, if you give me an advanced workout to do I’ll put it to the test.
April 18th, 2007 at 10:08 am
I won’t give you a workout, coz I don’t know what you’re like and how you train. But I’ll give you a few pointers so that you can work one out for youself.
- Aim for between 6-8 exercises
- Don’t train each muscle group with too much volume in one session i.e. don’t do squats and deadlifts in one session as you will ruin your quads or worse, your back
- Don’t train to failure with each exercise, always complete each set with the ability to push out one more rep
- Try to train 3 times a week for no longer than an hour each time
- As you will not be fatiguing the muscle completley, you will be able to lift more weight
- Big compound exercises over isolations
- However, isolations can be used wisely, for example, using cable cross-overs and bench press in one session to get maximum recruitment from the muscle fibres
- Superset with opposing muscle groups if you fancy it, for example, military press with chin-ups
- Make the eccentric (negative) twice as long as the concentric
- Train through soreness
- Eat plently of calories
- If you feel a bit sore after, stretch thouroughly
- Perform a total body joint mobility warm-up before starting (free sqauts, trunk rotations, shrugs, neck rotations etc.)
Remember that there are hundreds of exercises to choose from. Pick some traditional ones and some new ones and select your desired rep/set range and good luck!
April 19th, 2007 at 4:44 pm
FAO WILL-
i have found what you said very interesting, i have done both full and split and like you say i did get fast results doing the full body workouts. that was about 2years ago i did this, i was not too clued up about it at the time but it just so happened it was good for me. could you give me an example of a routine please. i consider myself very fit, im 25 years old 6′1 and 12stone im quite lean now and i want to put on some lean muscle for the summer, all my life i have always done some sort of training weather it be, boxing, running, weights, rowing etc… but as i say now i would like to build lean muscle for the summer so your help would be much appreciated
April 19th, 2007 at 7:51 pm
That actually does sound quite tempting to be honest Will and I may also take that up aswell as Ross!!